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/leftypol/ is a non-sectarian board for leftist discussion. Join our matrix! https://matrix.to/#/+leftychat:matrix.org

/leftybritpol/ Corbyn still hates Jews edition. Anonymous 07/25/2020 (Sat) 21:59:10 No. 719398 [Reply] [Last]
Literally Hitler.
534 posts and 79 images omitted.
>>720867 Kauffman?
>>723382 all three things are correct, but its because inherent societal racism, only libs could turn around and call you a racist for pointing out the effects of a racist society
>>724689 >muh racism
>>724689 black criminal: racism made me rob,rape and murder those people muslim terrorist: racism made me blow up those infidel kids at the music concert jewish porky: racism made me accumulate and own all this stuff This is what you think. This makes you a fucking moron.Your mind is spooked beyond recognition.Put down the radlib koolaid.
>>721108 ok based?

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Lumpen Anonymous 07/27/2020 (Mon) 21:43:07 No. 724250 [Reply] [Last]
Thread for discussing the revolutionary potential of the lumpen, and how important they are and how we should be focusing on them a lot more https://lumpen.libsyn.com/cultural-hegemony-antonio-gramsci-ft-themisanthropicphilosopher >Talking to the left now, like can you just stop ignoring this enormous source of revolutionary potential, both in theory, practice, and your language when describing the proletariat as the worker, which you're always talking about the worker, even Karl Marx is saying, "Workers of the world, unite" and it honestly just grinds my gears and makes me sick and makes me angry, you should be sick and angry and you need to stop talking about the worker, because the workers are not the masses, they're the most submissive, docile, they're worse than the hamster in a cage, they're a hamster in the pet shop, they haven't even got the freedom of their own cage. So, stop, stop focusing on the fucking workers so much, let them deal with the trade unions. >If you're a revolutionary focus on the lumpen, because these are the lads who are willing to fight, once they wake up once they get class consciousness, these are the lords of the people, these are the people with the revolutionary power and intent. I'm convinced, once we educate, once we support them, when they're gonna bring out all the blades, not to attack each other, when they're gonna bring out all the straps not to attack each other but to attack the system that's oppressing us all, you workers are not gonna do that, ever, that's why you have to be talking about the lumpen, you just have to focus on them, and you need to get on your hands and your knees and you need to start begging THEM to help out, you need to start seriously thinking about it. I can't be the only one doing this but I've never ever seen any other, anybody else ever seriously focus on this and speak directly to them, to the masses
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>>724250 There's little reason to distinguish between lumpens and proles when revolutionary subjectivity and the impulse to organize are absent from both categories today. What's the difference between disabled/unemployed who side with the state to protect their benefits, min.wage workers who side with the employers to protect their meager wages, and labor aristocrats who side with their unions/professional orgs. to protect their benefits?
>>725879 at least where i live the disabled and unemployed are far more discontented than labor aristocrats or non-aristocratic workers.
>>726249 A shitty job would make life worse for most.
Scorching hot take: Lumpen analysis is one of the weakest one in Marx and beside that in postindustrial capitalism the VAST majority of people is destined to be lumpen: participation rates to the workforce in the Us already fell 10% from their peak in the 70s and with everincreasing automation the future is mass estromission of the general populace from the productive process. We should start dealing with it and shifting our analysis in light of that.
Workers are docile. Lumpen are inept. There is no revolutionary subject, the final piece of idealism is to suppose there is such a subject.

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Class Position of Sex Workers Anonymous 07/28/2020 (Tue) 20:41:13 No. 726803 [Reply] [Last]
http://uregina.ca/~gingrich/s28f99.htm Lumpenproletariat Prostitutes who work independently or under a pimp / pornographer Petite bourgeoisie Independent pornographers Bourgeoisie Business owners (ex. Brazzers, PornHub/MindGeek, Hustler, Playboy, DMM Corporation) who employ prostitutes and sell pornography does /leftypol/ agree or disagree? why does lefty twitter think sex work is work?
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>>727096 >everyone I don't like is a TERF LOL at that Does the word TERF even mean anything anymore? Cockshott isn't even a radical feminist LOL
>>727424 He really is. >The development of first horticulture, and then plough agriculture then leads via forms of matriarchal marriage to patriarchal polygamous or monogamous marriage. The programmatic interest of Engels in what would otherwise seem arcane works of ethnology comes down I think, to his and Marx commitment way back in 1848 to the abolition of the family as it then exists. This is why he is so enthusiastic about Morgan’s discovery that group marriage was a general predecessor to modern marriage forms. Not only did this prove that contemporary marriage was just one of multiple possible forms; it suggested that just as society was, as the communists maintained, destined to move from primitive communism via class society to a future communism, so would marriage move from group or matriarchal family forms, via monogamy and private property, back to a future system of group sexual relations
>>727067 >breeders Unironically have sex
the absolute state of this thread
>>727613 not everyone can move up to the sexhaver class

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The 2014 syndrome Anonymous 07/24/2020 (Fri) 09:49:46 No. 714832 [Reply] [Last]
Will internet political discourse ever return to pre - 2014 levels? What made it go downhill so fast? The turning point was probably gamergate but there had to be other factors. What could be the next turning point? Many agree that it was the last normal year on the internet. Even apolitical people. This is an extremely interesting phenomenon that isworth thinking about.
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>>715529 I'm 20 years old, so no
>>715400 Woke idpol has definitely peaked, more and more people are coming out and criticising it without fear of being cancelled.
>>714832 Puting asside the usual caveats about nostalgia, I think everyone underestimates the effects of website structure on “discourse” There are a lot of stupid people - I dont doubt that - so any website not actively trying to filter them out will end up with at least a few of them. But every website is oriented towards EngagementTM which usually means getting people to say and interact as much as possible. Its understandable why they would be like this more ppl means more ad revenue, even in user funded website, more people means lower prices for each user more profit for the host (ill come back to this).But just getting people to say anyhting results in the kind of stupidity weve become accustomed to. And why wouldnt it? Its not like anything bad happens when one behaves like an idiot, most normie websites live on the thrill of finding a dumb post and ReactingTM to it. Even chan boards just devolve into idle contrarianism and repoosting the same crappy memes. Consider Tumblr, every blog belongs to a user who can customise it pretty deeply as they wish. The only way to regularly see a blgs content is to follow it and primary way of interacting with the site is through a feed made of posts from the blogs followed (twitter is literally just a less funcitonal tumblr). Even though content isnt really sorted by topics, strong communites can still form bc people with similar interests will follow each others blogs and thus only see each others content and so on. This is also how tumblr got the stereotyppe of being filled w/ sjws bc small groups which would be smothered or ridiculed of other sites can exist on it. In reality, its filled with all kinds, lefties, Nazis, tradcaths, abdl posters, evryone. The only way youll see unfollowed content is if you look for it or its difffusing in though your group. However, the only wway to understand what kind of impact a blog makes on the world is through notes. Rebloggging (rehosting content on your blog) and liking both add to notes so any kind of popularity has the same effect. its also difficult to keep any kind of conversation going bc there arent really responses, rather one can reblog a post with their comment underneath. Obv the OP is unlikely to see that, repeat a few times and the most popular content is a single intersting thing and then a hundered people typing OMFG underneath. Twitter is structured the same so the problems are the same. Check the replies of a popular dumb tweet and it probably 100s of ppl posting the exact same 'clever' reply in hopes of being retweeted or screenshoted My point is trying to say 'it god bad in 20xx' doesnt make sense. The sites we use now werent good but suddenly ruined, they were noise machines from the start and more people just lets them make noise more efficiently. What year you think things became bad is really just what hyear your tolerance started to wear thin

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>>714927 absolutely incredible
>>727524 Tbh I'd love that job. Just larp as a degenerate on government payroll while pretending to be looking for neo nazis.

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Anonymous 07/24/2020 (Fri) 16:59:42 No. 715449 [Reply] [Last]
What do you guys think about existentialism and is it possible to merge with marxism?
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>>715486 >>727205 LARGE brainlet energy 1) Nietzsche hated, HATED, populism and nationalism. To say that he was a proto-fascist is either incredibly insincere or ignorant. At best he was apolitical and at worst he was an aristocratic elitist. 2) How is the creation of values in a world in which all transcendent supports have fallen away, which Nietzsche saw as the most pressing problem during the late 19th century, not existentialist?
>>715486 He was not a proto-fascist. Fascists co-oopted him as a symbol mainly due to his fascist sister selectively posthumously publishing some of his works out of context. Even then he wrote strongly against anti-semitism of the Germans and went so far as breaking off the only few friendships (Wagner) he had because of their nationalist and anti-semitic opinions. He saw nationalism mainly as a spook and viewed it as slave morality.
Nietzsche is a land of contrasts. He definitely would've been one of those weird Twitter guys with a classical statue avatar (NEET-zsche), but when his fash sister's fash husband went to try to to start an ethnostate in Paraguay and they all died he laughed in her face about it. Also the fash husband killed himself because of it lmao OWNED. Nietzsche's fash sister then took over his estate after he died and finished his writings. Nietzsche's earlier writings were one of Emma Goldman's influences, however, and led to the development of anarchism in the Americas, by a Jewish woman. He also once joked that he was "having all anti-Semites shot." He had a few diatribes against socialism, and this is held by right-wing fans as evidence that he's a proto-fascist like them, but there's zero evidence that Nietzsche ever read Marx (none of his works were in his possession, and there's no mention of Marx or Marxism in any of his writings or correspondence). When Nietzsche goes off on socialism, the target he has in mind is the anti-Semitic utopian socialist Eugen Duhring -- the very same Duhring that Engels wrecked in his own classic text. Since Duhring's writings are almost never read today, this makes Duhring perhaps the well-known figure in intellectual history known primarily for getting owned by other, better thinkers. We mostly think of Marxism now but back then there were a lot of different socialisms floating about and getting owned like that. Anyways a lot of his thought is really complicated. Nietzsche called for the destruction of Germany and the German race, and the destruction of humanity of course, but it was for progress to overmen. Anyways here's a song: https://youtu.be/6kvlyVjjsis
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Based
>>727519 pǝsɐq

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/2020/ Anonymous 07/28/2020 (Tue) 18:43:34 No. 726484 [Reply] [Last]
i thread about watching the 2020 election unfold and most likely laughing at it
9 posts omitted.
>>726819 femboys are based
>>727125 nah it was mcaurthyism radlibs arent satan
>>727125 eh I would disagree. It was already dead, and bill clinton killed it
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Probably voting Howie, critical support to orange man for /based/ accidental anti-imperialism and less neoliberal treaties. >>726799 LOL, I can only hope picrel will become real.

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Anonymous 07/25/2020 (Sat) 08:40:40 No. 717533 [Reply] [Last]
Molotov-Ribbetrop deal is the biggest meme ever, atleast in my home country.
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>>721450 >When Poland takes "Polish" majority regions and continually allows for the suppression of minority populations in its own country, its legitimate >But when the USSR takes back Belorussian land the Poles opportunistically seized in 1920 while Russia was locked in a civil war, its the greatest betrayal
>>720954 look up Feliks Dzierżyński, Jarosław Dąbrowski, Marcin Kasprzak, Bolesław Bierut, Dąbrowszczacy, SDKPiL, 1905 revolution and so on and so on you fucking swine
>>717552 Where are you from?
>>721460 It was a secret arrangement made with imperialist factions in the German Army, not some liberal business as usual thing. All done directly against the Versailles treaty made by liberals to prevent another German chimpout. >>721761 It wasnt just training dumbass, the Germans used Russian manufacturing plants to develop new tanks, fighter planes, and chemical weapons. Massive cope by Soviet cucks who cant deal with the fact that their final boss bogeyman was a Golem they helped create and encourage
>>726880 >All done directly against the Versailles treaty As opposed to the multiple violations of the Versailles treaty prior that were ignored? The Versailles Treaty is universally considered to be the reason the Nazis gained support in the first place, because rather than following logical post-war reparations, they essentially shutdown the economy and independence of the country and drove millions of people into poverty. >inb4 Germany started WW-1 or some other dumbshit WW-1 was the expected end point of European imperialist conflict. >Muh Imperialist factions Babylon Berlin is a good series but it's also fictional, not an account of events. >Germans used Russian manufacturing plants to develop new tanks, fighter planes, and chemical weapons And? It was all long before 1939, the 6-10 year gap between which allowed for most technology and developments to become obsolete by then. The Germans started their war with the Panzer II and III and almost all their industrial production and resources came from the West. Trucks? GM and Ford plants across Germany with discount as well as the Renault plant in France. The Bf-109, the original mainstay fighter of the Luftwaffe was developed from a racing plane and had litle to do with the soviet training. The sites and materials used by the Germans remained in Soviet hands. Even if the Germans somehow acquired them after 1933, without the Rhineland, they would have nothing to start with. As posted before, the British and French preferred letting Germany get away with its indiscretions because they only cared about "muh Bolsheviks" To repost We must remember that the Soviet-German military projects were launched in the 1920s, and in 1922-1933 it was the so-called Weimar Republic. The Weimar Republic was a largely democratic state. It was hoped that Germany would eventually become a socialist republic or social-democratic at the least, even in spite of the turmoil in the country. In the 1920s, the USSR was an agrarian country with an economy that was beginning to recover after the First World War and following the Civil War/Foreign Intervention. Russia's first tank - "Fighter of Freedom - Comrade Lenin" - was copy of a Renault FT tank. By the availability of qualified specialists, USSR was also inferior to Germany; in Germany compulsory secondary education was introduced as early as 1871, while at the end of the Russian Empire the majority of the population was illiterate. After the defeat in the First World War, Russia and Germany were the most "offended" states. Their territories were torn away, the army of Germany was turned into a decorative one. Russia (now the Soviet Union) had to build new armed forces in conditions of international isolation. Russia lagged behind the advanced powers in a number of military technologies and the USSR made haste to catch up. In April 1922, during the conference in Genoa, Berlin and Moscow signed the Rapallo Treaty. Countries renounced claims to each other. Berlin recognized the nationalization of all German property in Russia. Traditional trade ties were restored. However the treaty did not contain military articles. In 1926 Germany and the USSR signed the Treaty of Berlin, which reaffirmed the Rapallo Treaty of 1922, essentially letting one another know that in the case of a third party attacking one of them, the other would not join against them. Germany needed landfills/polygons where it was possible to test the equipment. In the mid-1920s, an aviation school was established in Lipetsk (1925-1930) and a tank school in Kazan (1926). The tank school trained 30 people. The school in Lipetsk trained 200 German pilots in 5 years and nearly 150 Soviet pilots. Compare - in 1932 in the schools in Braunschweig and Reichlin the Germans prepared almost 2,000 pilots. After Hitler came to power, the schools were closed, all equipment on site went to the USSR. In the end, we can say that the Germans helped the Russians understand how to train tankmen and pilots and not the other way around. The Germans, with their own money, prepared their own and Soviet pilots and tankmen. None of the great German commanders were trained in the USSR, they came only for inspections (such as Guderian and Lutz in Kazan in the summer of 1932). Or they came to observe maneuvers of the Red Army. - https://history.wikireading.ru/7639 The USSR stopped relations with Germany when Hitler came to power, and no military aid of any kind was given during the nazi regime.

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Political Compass Results Anonymous 07/08/2020 (Wed) 14:53:20 No. 674851 [Reply] [Last]
Here are mine, rate
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>>674851 I'm the exact opposite, but I started as the liberal and I ended up as the socialist
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R8
>>706391 take the medication
>>693936 Fourier

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Was Chavez poisoned? Anonymous 07/28/2020 (Tue) 20:34:45 No. 726790 [Reply] [Last]
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2011/dec/29/hugo-chavez-us-cancer-plot Latin American "pink tide" leaders including Kirchner, Evo, Rousseff, Lugo, Lula and Chavez all developed cancer in the same year or two. Fidel, who had the foremost experience in assassination attempts, said to him: "Chávez, take care. These people have developed technology. You are very careless. Take care what you eat, what they give you to eat… a little needle and they inject you with I don't know what."
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>>726820 I don't question that there is a posibility Chavez was poisoned. The problem is, why the cuban doctors failed to cure him and/or demonstrate there was a plot to give cancer. Becuase he had a full staff of cuban doctors taking care of him. If I remember correctly, at least once Chavez refered to the "HAARP conspiracies" linking it to the earthquake of 2010 in Haiti. https://invidio.us/watch?v=Q9QtZkT8OBQ
>>726857 How probable is it that all these left-wing leaders get cancer around the same time, while ghouls like Kissinger and so on live to be 100? >>726834 I wonder if there is a way of protecting leaders from assassinations like these. Castro seemed to adept at avoiding them...
>Fidel, who had the foremost experience in assassination attempts, said to him: "Chávez, take care. These people have developed technology. You are very careless. Take care what you eat, what they give you to eat… a little needle and they inject you with I don't know what." bullshit but I believe it
>>726899 what's bullshit about it? they got arafat too. the only thing i'm wondering is why they couldn't kill castro, or xi, or kim if they have these technologies so readily available. do those guys have better security?
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>>726873 >>726901 >better security? Castro had a ridiculously effective security agency, and it was also comparably big for a small island like Cuba, so the fact that they didn't mange to assassinate Castro isn't very surprising. >>726790 The claim here boils down to poison. There are two difficulties, the first is transmission route and the second is the medical evidence. The US probably has developed stuff that is hard to detect, although when heads of states die in office that would probably entail a very thorough autopsy, which risks exposing the secret poison. For transmitting the poison it's probably very hard to get to a head of state, so it probably requires a way for remote transmission. Does anybody have evidence for something along the lines of a poison dart that disappears after it delivered the poison ?

Chinese "propaganda" Anonymous 07/27/2020 (Mon) 18:12:58 No. 723441 [Reply] [Last]
Found this on a Chinese website posted in /prc/. The article had a really funny thumbnail (a guy drinking bleach) so I clicked and read it through google translate:   How did the United States "die"?   This is the United States. The beacon of capitalism is to demonize, degenerate, and turn people into ghosts. Obviously he has become the "New Year of the Pig", but he still believes in the breeders and butchers, chanting the scriptures frantically, and praising the great America one by one.   When a country or a society reaches the end of the world, people will become more and more extreme, crazy, anti-intellectual, selfish, and unreasonable, and they will fall into group fanaticism. And from top to bottom, no one is spared, sober people can't make a sound, and no one listens to them.   American politicians are not as good as one generation. The Bush administration is stupid and arrogant, and the Obama administration is hypocritical and contrived. In the Trump administration's generation, it can be called the pinnacle, deducting selfishness, shamelessness, underwriting, and mental retardation to the extreme. In the entire White House, you can hardly find a normal person. Either the president is spreading anti-intellectual speech, or the secretary of state is inciting hatred.   You can't believe that such "humanoid creatures" with no bottom line can hold high positions and become leaders of the country. You find it ridiculous, but this is the reality of American politics. The "democracy", "freedom", "human rights", "separation of powers", and "two-party checks and balances" that the well-known cents have been boasting for decades... We have not seen it, we only see a mind The abnormal giant baby ruled the entire United States. "The new crown virus is a political conspiracy of the Democratic Party", "the virus will magically disappear", "no one understands the new crown virus better than me", "99% of the new crown cases are harmless", and "100,000 deaths show that we are doing our job. "Yes", "Disinfectant water can kill the virus", "The world's first confirmed diagnosis is the Medal of Honor of the United States", "It's all China's fault, China virus"! "Those who take to the streets are all losers and lower beings"...   I swear I did not lie, these words have all existed, and the Internet has memories.

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>>726317 Hard to say. Obama did start the pivot to Asia, but at the same time his "guys" are the kind of porkies who prefer further global integration. Which kinda fits with the tone of the documentary; it's a bit of a hedge. Yes, the Chinese look pretty crude, and the collusion between the company owner and the local CPC cell when the docu turns to China proper is very glaring. Yet the general take-away by the end seems to be that a Chinese factory is better than no factory, for the Midwest, and that problems can be assuages with labour organizing. Social democracy by 2050 basically.
Good shit. I look forward to the Asian Century.
>>726290 It got a revival a couple months ago when Trump suggested drinking bleach would heal COVID.
>>726328 "America" isn't a bunch of random workers in buttfuck Ohio.
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>>726333 I think Obama and the people around him were basically believers in Nixonian / Kissingerian "realpolitik." >Goldberg: Just to be clear: The stability of the planet depends on its two most powerful countries understanding what the other wants. >Kissinger: And that requires transparency toward each other about their motives, which sounds very strange to traditional diplomats. >Goldberg: Does it sound very strange to you? >Kissinger: Somewhat, but if you read the transcripts of my earliest conversations with Zhou Enlai [the Chinese premier with whom Kissinger met secretly in 1971 as part of the effort to open relations], you will notice two things. The first is that we were lucky, because we had no practical day-to-day relationship to talk about—except Taiwan, which we set aside—so, in order to build confidence, we had to talk about our philosophies of world order. And two, as a consequence, we sounded like two college professors discussing the nature of the world and its future. >This sort of dialogue is not apparent in contemporary U.S.-China dialogue. Leaders meet and have useful conversations in the sense that there are practical items—a lot of items—that they have to work through. Yet the Chinese leave such conversations frustrated. The primary subject they wanted to discuss—philosophical in nature—is never raised, which is, “If we were you, we might try to suppress your rise. Do you seek to suppress us? If you do not, what will the world look like when we are both strong, as we expect to be?” >Goldberg: How should the president go about systematically solving problems with China? >Kissinger: It is important to understand the difference between how we and the Chinese perceive issues. Americans think that the normal condition of the world is stability and progress: If there is a problem, it can be removed by the mobilization of effort and resources, and when it is solved, America can return to isolation. The Chinese believe that no problem ever can ever be finally solved. Therefore, when you talk to Chinese strategists, they talk about process rather than ad hoc issues. When you talk to U.S. strategists, they generally try look for solutions.

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