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How tf were the Anglos of all fucking people seen as the "World's Policeman"? Anonymous 07/31/2020 (Fri) 23:15:45 No. 735742 [Reply] [Last]
Is it because they beat the shit out of the global poor the most?
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>>737483 >You should.Theyve taken over the manstream left and destroyed it. Theyre also the biggest recruitment sgts for the far right backlash. bruh i don't live in the west >Sectarianism in the north between ulsterscot and native irish is a long standing problem which is now divorced from any English/British polity or imperial ambition. It is a matter of two competing ethno-religious identities. >I want a unifying socialist vision to transcend these differences and eventually a federal socialist union of the Isles. Progress in this area will never occur with bitter recriminations and outdated anti-brit hatred and finger pointing. bruh i ain't from the west
>>737543 >bruh i don't live in the west Fair enough then.That would explain you misunderstanding the wider context of my posts.No biggie.
>>737543 Check your non-western privilege
>>737555 first let me check those numbers
Bump bump bump bump

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Capital by Marx Anonymous 07/05/2020 (Sun) 12:07:49 No. 667930 [Reply] [Last]
First time reader here Is it ok to ask some questions? Maybe some other comrades who have not read this can join in this thread and we can read together. Anyway I am puzzled by this passage: >The introduction of power-looms into England, for example, probably reduced by one half the Labour required to convert a given quantity of yarn into woven fabric. In order to do this, the English hand-loom weaver in fact needed the same amount of Labour-time as before; but the product of his individual hour of labour now only represented half an hour of social labour, and consequently fell to one half its former value. Is the point here that for the hand weaver, the social labour fell not because of anything he did but because of the outside forces that had invented a new technology? Thus is social labour a sort of floating value that is dependent on the most productive technology in operation? If for example someone invented a gizmo that could produce 10,000 bolts of cotton in one second, would we see that the hand weaver, carrying on usual, see his product represent a social labour of a tiny fraction of a second?
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Bumping this thread because I just read Chapter 3, and I barely understood a thing beyond the C-M-C cycle. I was pretty tired when I read the first half yesterday, might have been a bad idea to keep going, but I've been putting off reading this chapter for months, and I wanted to get done with it so I can finally tackle the rest, which I've heard is easier to follow. I've understood in Chapter 2 that money is a commodity, and while it could technically be anything, precious metals are the most practical form of commodity money. So far so good. However, nowadays, money isn't a commodity anymore. Fiat money doesn't have any intrinsic value, and there is basically no difference in the socially necessary labor time expended when a central bank decide to create $100 or $1,000,000 of currency. I've heard nice theories, most notably by Jehu and Ted Reese, explaining why the world economy abandoned commodity money in 1971, and why value still matters in the end, and I think their insights are extremely interesting, explain a lot of things about automation, and I have no problem with them (pic related). My problem is that Marx is explaining to me his theory of money within the context of the 19th-century, with god-awful Hegelian prose, and I'm absolutely lost. My main question is: Will I miss anything important if I don't spend more time on this chapter? I plan to read the third chapter of Heinrich's Introduction to the Three Volumes of Capital before moving on, just to be sure I have a good grasp of the categories of value, money, and so on. Is it okay to do so and not bother with that chapter anymore for now? My second question is: Why does Marx say the amount of gold/silver a nation holds doesn't determine the prices of commodities? It's true that it is in direct contradiction with the thesis that value is determined by SNLT, but it would explain why commodities are cheaper in one country than one other. Moreover, what happens in an economy fueled by commodity money when overall, more value is produced than what can traded through money and a credit system? Is that what Marx was referring to when he was mentioning monetary crises at the end of the chapter? Last question: Why would a banker hide £600,000 under his desk (ref. footnote #51 on marxists.org)? Did he conspired to create a little monetary crisis so porky would need to borrow more from him?
>>723902 Calling money a commodity wasn't a good move by Marx I think. Suppose you don't do that, it's easy then 1. to talk about use value as having existential priority over exchange value (a thing can be a use value without having exchange value, never vice versa) 2. and to say that that use values of commodities and their respective exchange values are not quantitatively related 3. and to explain that exchange value usually has to do with the socially necessary labor time for producing the thing in question. But if you say that money is a commodity, you have to add an exception to the above by saying that the exchange value is the use value of money, which sound awfully punny. You then also have to either add another exception to the above since fiat currency is not produced in a competitive way or alternatively (and worse IMHO) treat fiat currency as an abnormality and money made of precious metals as the only proper money. Ming era China already had paper currency, so that Capital is from the Victorian era is no excuse here.
>>667930 maybe because the automated element of production is a "non-social" input? or perhaps it is leading to the more abstract notion that laborers are fundamentally socially interested in their communities, and so the social factors of production represent an equal social capital accumulation within the community, to which the automated elements would weaken the strength of these social inputs, or replace them altogether? perhaps it is a mathematical framing of the abstract notion of how automated production elements "reduce the human" side of production so to speak?
>>672577 dіlate commie
>>739664 FUCK NO. You clearly haven't read Capital. OP got it basically right with his guess.

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Glowie AMA on reddit gets BTFO: How? Anonymous 07/27/2020 (Mon) 01:51:02 No. 722039 [Reply] [Last]
Sophie Richardson did an AMA on reddit's worldnews subforum. She is the "China Director" of the Human Rights Watch and industriously authors dozens of articles a quarter manufacturing consent for the balkanization of China: https://www.hrw.org/about/people/sophie-richardson Basically a run-of-the-mill warmongering goon, as far as propagandists go. What I am interested in is understanding how she was BTFO by reddit in her AMA: https://removeddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/hwi7ub/i_am_sophie_richardson_china_director_at_human/# Reddit's upvote/downvote scheme makes it one of the most resonant echochambers on the internet and it is possibly the most vociferously anti-China website around. Its users are also profoundly uncritical, easily misled, and resolutely misinformed. So what has happened that on a default subreddit, chinaposters managed to obliterate this AMA? Here are some fine rebuttals in the thread, but more interesting are the incredible vote distributions on pro- vs anti-china sentiments: > (72 points) How do you deal with the obvious tendency of the current US administration to vilify anything and everything China with at times very see-through propaganda and outright lies? Does this affect your work? It's unclear to me what particular "see-through propaganda and outright lies" would constitute the assumed common knowledge referenced in this comment. Reddit rejoices, site-wide, in the most fantastical of those lies: uighur cleansing, falun gong organ harvesting, 5G hacking; reddit eats this up. Why in this thread is everyone on-board with the fact they are being fed lies about China? > (43 points) How are the Chinese police structured? Are they structured in such a way that any abuse of regular Chinese (ie non-Tibetans/Uighurs/Falun Gong/Christians) will see them punished/reprimanded/prosecuted? Is there police abuse in China of regular Chinese even?

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>>739538 Probably isn't helping. Containment boards never help, just leads to them growing and festering until they start oozing out else and if you ban them at this stage they just burst out like an abscess.
>>738548 adding this would be a perfect clip if it ended with a map of the world and all the CIA invaded countries saying "terminated" like in the incredibles movie
>>738291 >what can you do about it? >call your senators! >boycott nike! lmao the impotence

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Anonymous 08/02/2020 (Sun) 18:37:56 No. 739477 [Reply] [Last]
Out of the top 10 countries listed in the democracy index, 7 of them are monarchies. In the top 10 countries listed by human development 4 are monarchies. I am in support of a strong monarchy, with enlightenment values, and a healthy respect for the human spirit, because aonstitutional monarchy with a 50/50 split between parliament and monarch is the best form of governance. Anchoring for reactionary nonsense
Edited last time by CL_anon on 08/02/2020 (Sun) 19:40:40.
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>>739496 This. Even I am pessimistic about the royal states. increasingly starting to like the idea of monarchy without a crown
>>739496 >>739529 >>739677 I'm not an American. I come from the United Kingdom myself. 80% of the country supports the continued existence of the monarchy. In the country I now reside, the Kingdom of the Netherlands, the support for the monarchy is 78% While these are not perfect monarchies, and don't follow a 50/50 split, they serve as great examples. Certainly better than any modern communist nation, excluding the Zapatistas, and China which is no more communist than Japan.
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>>739477 CL_anon is a faggot
>>739477 >niggér
>>739477 >Not supporting absolute monarchy and enlightened despotism Peasant

Anonymous 08/01/2020 (Sat) 23:49:56 No. 737901 [Reply] [Last]
I used to think around feburary of this year that the best trajectory for the American left was to unify as closely as possible the few leftist parties present with unions such as the iww in a sort of pseudo deleonist line but now I'm not so sure Is this, and by extension deleonism, still tenable? Pic unrelated
>>737901 why are you not so sure now about it?
Left unity basically already exists, the problem is there are far fewer people on the left than leftists tend to think there are. But yes, having the correct line that can win mass support is what you should do. Facing outward and building the working class movement seems like a better orientation than trying to corral a bunch of small groups who hate each other together. But the line you should want is "things that work for our society" instead of being too pure ideologically. De Leon could be very dogmatic in a way. There's also a common misappropriation of Mao's idea that "the mass line will inevitably win over the public" into meaning "if I can make my six friends agree with me our weekly meetings will swell in number and we will build communism" instead of "the line that attracts the most people to revolutionary activity is necessarily the correct one." <-- It's this. You have to be able to solve people's problems first. There is COVID, economic problems, problems of police brutality and racism. These are immediate problems that act on people in their lives. It's not like most Vietnamese or Chinese people read Das Kapital in the original German when they joined the communists. It's not like most people care about what Marxism means when they're being gassed or shot to death by police and white supremacists. We have to prove to the people we're on their side through our own actions. Speaking personally, the thing that brought me to the left was Charlottesville, not because I really knew anything about Marxism. I was pissed off at Nazis and I remember seeing images of socialists there with red flags who were willing to go out and confront those assholes and I was like "I'm going to join the socialists now." It's like, oh gee, these people seem like they're actually willing to fight against the people I find threatening and bad, and will protect me if the bad people tried to attack me, so I will join their cause. The concept is very simple once you break it down into the basic logic. https://youtu.be/neI-ol2AowM
>>739376 >But yes, having the correct line that can win mass support is what you should do. I don't think this has ever been what has won mass support. I think people have rallied around personalities far more than around a correct line.
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>>739397 Probably helps. But Nelson Mandela, who was this world-historical figure, emerged from prison after spending 27 years locked up to a mass support base, most of whom had never even SEEN him before. And he wasn't even a good speaker. He was wooden, kinda flat. Foreign observers commented on it at the time because it confused them. But the ANC was doing the work and building support among the people and fighting the struggle.

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Is protectionism "anti-imperialist"? Anonymous 08/02/2020 (Sun) 17:55:05 No. 739401 [Reply] [Last]
Is protectionism, the practice of tarrifs on imports in order to keep jobs within the nation "anti-imperialist" or is it merely another kind of financial imperialism?
Protectionism was the dominant economic stance of the Western Imperial powers throughout the height of the colonial period (predominantly via Mercantilism). Protectionism is not inherently anti-imperialist and is often used to protect the Imperial core.
Only when china does it
Marx personally was for free trade and against protectionism from an accelerationist standpoint, whether you think that argument still holds up is up to you.
>>739401 It can be both I suppose. It could be used to keep foreign capital out , but it can also perpetuate imperialism by keeping its corporations strong and powerful, so they can engage in Imperialism.
>>739423 This but unironically.

Anonymous 07/02/2020 (Thu) 10:35:03 No. 660833 [Reply] [Last]
Stalin: >ruled for 25 years over a territory of 22,402,200 km2 >population under his rule: 150million in 1927 - 196million before WW2 >average population number under his rule: 173 000 000 >3.3 million excess deaths under his rule (executions, gulags, etc. not counting the holo and the domor) >math: 173,000,000 / 3,300,000 = 52.42 Every 52th citizen died under Stalin. >Time And Territory Adjusted Excess Deaths (TATAED - a term I just made up, measured in metric units of "horror") >math: (every citizen dieded + time) * horror constant [100,000] / territory = (25+52) * 100,000 / 22,402,200 = 0.3437 TATAED: 0.34 horror, or 34 centihorror Anarchist Catalonia: >(un)ruled for 3 whole years over a territory of 32,108 km2 >average population under their (un)rule: 2.8million >excess deaths (executions, gulags, etc.) between 38000 and 72344, average: 55000 >math: 2,800,000 / 55,000 = 50.9 Every 51th citizen died under anarchism.

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>>710225 >This answer may contain sensitive images. Click on an image to unblur it. d-did they just fucking TRIGGER WARNING simple images of Stalin, holy shit?
>>733374 Yep, fairly common occurrence on quora >>733369 Get out burger
>>660833 >land area All countries have an uneven distribution of population.
>>660840 funny thing, what we fight against is not subjective alienation, as one can feel at home under capitalism and the solution would be to accept its ideology. What we fight against is objective alienation at the level of production, so how one might feel is but a petty preocupation for that person in particular
>>733369 >actually believing that

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Marginal Utlity Anonymous 08/01/2020 (Sat) 07:19:19 No. 736661 [Reply] [Last]
As a theory makes no god damn sense to me as an alternative to the labor theory of value. With the LTV, you have constant capital, variable capital, and surplus value, where variable capital is how much it costs to keep your workers showing up to work, constant capital is the means of production, and surplus value (profit) is the difference between C + V and the price at which the commodity is sold on the open market. And the reason why firms dont charge a fuckton for most products is because they would easily be undercut by a rival firm. And the reason why certain products do cost a fuckton is because it's more profitable to make people pay out the ass for said product because it is an inelastic good and even if most people cannot afford it, it's okay because value can still be extracted by the top 20% of the population who can afford the product, and everybody else can just take on debt. US healthcare is a golden example of this. While marginal utility is what? the value of goods comes from how much people are willing to pay for it? It just feels so nebulous to me. So something costs X because people say it costs X? If workers aren't exploited, then where does surplus value come from? Why dont socks and pants carry the same price tag? After all, socks and shirts share an equal demand. People generally wear socks as much as they wear tshirts do they not? How come a common tshirt costs like 20$ but you can buy a pack of a dozen socks for 10$? What are some common bourgeoi economist answers to these questions? And what are some common arguments used against the LTV by said economists? Also, why does the logic taught in mainstream economics feel so detached from reality and sociopathic? For example, you have the prisoner dilemma, where they teach you that selling out the other inmate is the better choice, even though if both of you were to plead innocent, you both would get a lighter sentence and the outcome would benefit you both? How can people believe this marginal utility bullshit? It's like saying grass is green because grass is green.
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>>736804 Yachts aren’t at supply and demand equilibrium. But a piece of gum compared to a bucket of paint is where the LTV comes in.
shameless bump for more responses
why does a piece of bread cost the same to a billionaire and a homeless guy when the homeless guy needs it more?
>>738606 In theory, different people have different ability and willingness to pay, so distinguishing customers according to that would maximize your profits. But customers being able to exchange items and money between themselves limits the possibilities of price discrimination between customers of the same thing. It's different when you sell a service. Those receiving the service cannot transport it to another person. What limits price discrimination between customers here is competition on the supply side.
Every time workers go on strike they are experimentally verifying LTV. The independent variable is whether or not labor happens, and without MOP but no labor porky can't make value.

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ALIENS ARE REAL AND WE HAVE ONE OF THEIR SHIPS/posada was right Anonymous 07/24/2020 (Fri) 07:15:25 No. 714606 [Reply] [Last]
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/23/us/politics/pentagon-ufo-harry-reid-navy.html >Eric W. Davis, an astrophysicist who worked as a subcontractor and then a consultant for the Pentagon U.F.O. program since 2007, said that, in some cases, examination of the materials had so far failed to determine their source and led him to conclude, “We couldn’t make it ourselves. >Mr. Davis, who now works for Aerospace Corporation, a defense contractor, said he gave a classified briefing to a Defense Department agency as recently as March about retrievals from “off-world vehicles not made on this earth."
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>>715827 >>715738 whole things a psyop. if trump becomes the ayy lmao president thats an ez win. yall boutta see alien peener in october
>>714606 Did they do an isotope analysis? Because IIRC, every base element in the solar system have the same ratios between isotopes? In theory you could forge an object to have a different ratio. But it is hard. If there's an undiscovered way of propulsion and flight then the "ayy" aircraft may be run by a private organization. Hell, it could even belong to a single family that has kept silent for decades. It could also be that the UFOs are really red cell exercises. Consider incident preparedness. Friendly countries always test each other. NATO used to make intrusion on swedish airspace. And the quicker the swedish airforce responded, the better test result. Technically, it was red cell exercises. So why not test people by feeding the radar fake data with impossible aircraft? Not only can you see if the radar operators are alert, but also if they can recognize patterns.
>>724810 >we try to contact isolated primitive tribes constantly though, even the Sentinelese who kill outsiders on sight have had many contact attempts Primitive tribes are largely isolated by authority efforts. They are attempted to be contacted by individuals, and it's shunned upon. Sentinel islands are literally blockaded. >>724792 >tfw we are the undiscovered tribe of the galaxy One can imagine that development of interstellar travel is a test on maturity of the species, which generally proves that the species are fit to be considered sentient and suitable for life, and not, say, destructive barbarians or animals that can be used as pets or beasts of burden.
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>>732489 >This is a story fed to media by glowies to secure funding for the Pentagon's space force I think that could be part of it, but also a Hollywood-inspired viral marketing / recruiting campaign for the Navy and Air Force. If you follow the defense papers you'll know there's a big shortage of pilots and a variety of computer / tech / cyber fields that they need to achieve (and expand) their "pivot to Asia" goals to fight a war with China. The problem is anyone with brains and is good with computers doesn't want to join the U.S. military, especially when they can make more money in the private sector. Promising them a "good time" fighting a war with China will probably turn more people away from the military. And Middle East wars don't sell anymore. You have to give impressionable young people a reason to believe in the military, and the military has probably spent a ton of money figuring out that tech geeks like science fiction and stuff like that. It's all so obvious if you think about it for a second and it's also very American in that idiot savant way that only we're capable of being. https://youtu.be/6Q7fxXKpu1E
>>738748 >One can imagine that development of interstellar travel is a test on maturity of the species, which generally proves that the species are fit to be considered sentient and suitable for life, and not, say, destructive barbarians or animals that can be used as pets or beasts of burden. So the prime direction from star trek is real?

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Nina Andreeva dies at 91 Anonymous 07/27/2020 (Mon) 16:43:13 No. 723278 [Reply] [Last]
Nina Aleksandrovna Andreyeva was a Russian chemist, teacher, author, political activist, and social critic. A supporter of classical Soviet principles, she wrote an essay entitled I Cannot Forsake My Principles that defended many aspects of the traditional Soviet system, and criticized General Secretary Mikhail Gorbachev and his closest supporters for not being true communists. In the rebuke published in the official party newspaper Pravda the essay was called The Manifesto of Anti-Perestroika Forces. PRESS F
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The "vatnik" meme has Soros psyops written all over it. And yes, it is culturally racist and dehumanizing
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>>726161 Adjusted to dollar I mean. Also one dollar is thirty hryvna. One dollar is seventy rubles.
>>724642 >He's a "piece of shit" that at least managed to defend some of the gains of the Revolution. Defending revolution is when: http://www.compromat.ru/page_10373.htm?gx9f97e4522781d0d62d21de9951edd1ef=00af9e2f8b1cb11719011ae076964fae
>>728787 quick (english language) rundown?
>>723282 How right she was about the liberal playwrights and other "intellectuals": <The role played by the proletarian masses and the Bolshevik party is reduced to the "background" against which the actions of irresponsible politicians unfold. <(…) <I support the party's call to uphold the honor and dignity of the trailblazers of socialism. I think that these are the party-class positions from which we must assess the historical role of all leaders of the party and the country, including Stalin. In this case, matters cannot be reduced to their "court" aspect or to abstract moralizing by persons far removed both from those stormy times and from the people who had to live and work in those times, and to work in such a fashion as to still be an inspiring example for us today. >>724359 >She was a Russian chauvinist, she supported the Russian annexation of Crimea and the war in Donbas Crimea is overwhelmingly Russian, though? It was given to Ukraine in the 50s, that was in the context of both Russia and Ukraine being part of the USSR. The majority of people in these regions are fed up with Ukrainian chauvinism and outright neonazi movements. You are reversing perpetrator and victim and you are calling the reaction against racism racist.


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