/games/ - Games

Vidya, Table Top games, Hopsotch, etc

catalog
Mode: Reply
Name
E-mail
Subject
Message

Max message length: 8192

Files

Max file size: 80.00 MB

Max files: 5

Password

(used to delete files and postings)

Misc

Remember to follow the rules


(38.07 KB 418x300 fallout-2-article_image.jpg)
(72.85 KB 640x640 1525740508234.jpg)
(155.68 KB 1125x1082 zkb6wuj3ana21.jpg)
Oldout thread Anonymous Comrade 10/24/2019 (Thu) 23:05:16 No. 2743
Old Fallout discussion, politics themes in the games and basic dunking on the shallowness of Bethesda's Fallouts.

Fallout 1&2 had some pretty anti-capitalist messages that never showed up in 3&4 methinks and the whole point of the series was shining light overexploitation and human conflict being self-destructing.
(333.36 KB 500x358 904.png)
(32.10 KB 750x709 8dz1gul9yei31.jpg)
>Nuclear werfare doesn't lead to the next step of human evolution
These games may be not be Posadaspilled, but they are awesome anyway.

I have played till completion every single of the games but fallout 2 and fallout 76.
Fallout 3 is a Gnostic Christian (the church of atom as materialist pagans and water as the omega point in Omega Point Theory) critic to the utilitarian transhumanism and fascism of the Enclave.
One of the aspects I like about F3 is that it is quite charitable when it comes to analyze planned economies (such as the Brotherhood), direct democracies (such as Megaton and Rivet City) and anarchist communes (like the ghoul one).
Fallout NV touches pretty heavily into politics as well, it seems to have certain libertarian bias.
Fallout 4 without any doubt is the most goofy of them all when it comes down to politics, certain factions such as the Institute (reductive materialists, fascists and transhumanists) and the Minuteman (like the Boomers from F:NV but less innovative and genuine) feel forced
>>2744
>FO3 politics
the only real politics Fallout 3 had was in the Pitt DLC and dealt with power politics but ultimately didn't go much further than that because of AAA games not wanting to piss off potential players

NV explores the entire fucking political spectrum, not just Mr. House style Libertarians, it's just that Mr. House and Yesman are the most fleshed out because the game was rushed and we only get about 33% of the final product and Mr House was the first on the to-do list so it appears like it leans his way, however the NCR is the typical corrupt liberal democracy with the redeeming factors of being flexible enough to face any storm while Caesar is on the surface a fascist but is really just a Marxist accelerationist who's playing the bad guy just to speed up the NCR's progress towards overthrowing its liberal democracy in order to face a real threat(he literally mentions dialectics and Marx and in the cut content you go to Flagstaff to help a slave revolt at which point Caesar reveals that was his plan all along and then kills himself so you become the paragon of the wasteland as he was the final boss, cool guy)

Fallout 4...... ugh..... it dealt with some cool themes like the idea of whether Synths are actually people, things, or a creation whose master left it to rot in a world not ready for it(straight from Frankenstein) but never ever touches upon this other than hinting at it. The story is so bland that whereas Caesar went on a 50 page long monologue about how he needs to be evil so that good can triumph over him, when you ask Father why the institute is the big baddy he literally responds "you wouldn't understand". HE LITERALLY JUST BRUSHES YOU OFF INSTEAD OF EXPLAINING THE DRIVING FORCE OF THE GAME WTF.

Fallout 1 is more about looking at Maslow's hierarchy of needs in a post-apocalyptic environment, ie the driving force of the game is the water chip cause you know water is important, at which point greater needs arise(The Master) and you focus on that instead and despite being the big brave good guy you still get fucked cause hehe survival requires control of ignorance in a controlled environment, no variables allowed. Plus the Master. Ohhh boy that guy is the best damn villain of all time hands down, as in he's actually the good guy but has flawed logic, he just wants everyone to survive and he thinks he has the best way, but when pointed out that A: this is just fancy eugenics, and B: his new race isn't so great after all since they're all sterile, he realizes his plan has no point and therefore just gives up because he turned out to be the bad guy.

Fallout 2 is just a massive critique of the US, as in shady CIA stuff, literal black helicopters flying around doing shady stuff, everything is actually just a controlled experiment because lol knowledge, despite there never being an application for said knowledge, and massive eugenics which while sounding good on paper only benefits a very select few and they just happen to be in power.

TL;DR: Old Fallout more cynical and in depth, modern Fallout tries to pander too much and while having some good core themes to work with never fully develops their potential with the exception of NV whose shallowness comes not from bad devs but the fact 2/3rds of the damn story is missing due to deadlines.
>>2745
>(he literally mentions dialectics and Marx and in the cut content you go to Flagstaff to help a slave revolt at which point Caesar reveals that was his plan all along and then kills himself so you become the paragon of the wasteland as he was the final boss, cool guy)
I knew the Hegel shit but god damn, that was planned to be in the game at some point?
>>2746
That and a lot more, there's notes floating around somewhere about all the cut stuff but basically Hoover dam was supposed to be about the midpoint of the map and it stretched further on both sides, Flagstaff is Flagstaff Arizona afterall which is halfway across the damn state, and was supposed to deal with the whole industrial vs agrarian society that Marx pointed out as a society needs to have developed industry to have a revolution and this was one of the critiques of Caesar was that he was preemptively trying to kickstart the revolution when he was missing the foundations needed for it in the first place.

Also if you think NV's cut content was rough, just check out Van Buren, the cut Fallout 3 game, it was basically gonna be Fallout 2: 2 and had pretty much what you'd expect and was about 70% done when it was cancelled back in the early 2000s, now that game was woke.
>>2743
Josh sawyer(writer/designer of new vegas) seems to be an anarchist/socialist. He reccomend people join the DSA and I think that the indepedent ending being one of the best shows hes leaning.
>>2745
>he literally mentions dialectics and Marx

When does he mention Marx? I have never heard of this. His dialogue is good and convincingly gives the impression of a radical scholar turned warlord turned emperor of warlords, they did an excellent job with his character considering how rushed the game was, but the actual theoretical content there isn't THAT mind blowing it's just not the kind of knuckle dragging hand holding stuff games normally do. Sauce on this removed content youre claiming?
New Reno - Anarcho Capitalism
The NCR - Social Democracy
Vault City - Slave Society
Caesars Legion - Slave Society / fascism
The Unity / Masters Army - Stalinism
New Vegas - Anarcho Capitalism
The Khans - Clan Society
>>2749
He mentions Marx when talking about Graham at some point, although it could just be part of the cut content mod I got installed but either way it's still in the game's files somewhere. As for the sauce on the cut content, there's dozens and dozens of well documented delves into what NV could have been as it's basically become a case study of rushed production(funnily enough Obsidian also had to rush Knights of the Old Republic II and had to cut tons of stuff) here's a vidya that's pretty concise about some of the cut stuff for Caesar's Legion alone:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ihbACZVw5AA

it really doesn't help with the fact that J.E. Sawyer himself goes around forums talking about rumors and thus impossible to ever hit on the head, seriously the guy's the gaming industry's version of bigfoot since he never does interviews but releases his own mods for NV for how he thinks it should have been, how the hell is anything official with the guy?
>>2743
>hey let's talk about how great the old fallouts are and how shitty Bethesda's fallouts are
>next post immediately sucks off FO3
I feel bad for op tbh.
>>2745
>and then kills himself
That part sounds lame. Should have dueled you or something.
>>2752
>Should have dueled you or something
He can do that too, it's just that there's *gasps* multiple endings. The talking him down part only happens actually if you have the speech requirements, discovered the flaws in the supermutant genes and use the right logic against him. Otherwise you have to fight him.
>>2751
fuck i was already mad enough about the lost potential of New Vegas. this is cool but makes me so much more depressed about it
(165.68 KB 1280x720 OheyO.jpg)
Alright I'm taking this thread back

Now let's discuss The Master.
>>2755
The fact you can convince him to kill himself proves his ideology was garbage.
>>2753
Anon was talking about cut content in New Vegas, idiot. Everyone knows about the master.
>>2756
Yeah, it reminds me of something...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QXAPdwOza9U
>>2757
ow be careful not to cut yourself on that edge.
>>2756
It was only garbage because he didn't detect a flaw in the technology he was using and was too far along in his plan to correct it.
>>2747
>Hoover dam was supposed to be about the midpoint of the map
Holy shit, what a goddamn waste
>>2745 >Caesar is on the surface a fascist but is really just a Marxist accelerationist who's playing the bad guy just to speed up the NCR's progress towards overthrowing its liberal democracy in order to face a real threat(he literally mentions dialectics and Marx and in the cut content you go to Flagstaff to help a slave revolt at which point Caesar reveals that was his plan all along and then kills himself I know what faction I'm playing as next time I run FNV.
>>2758 On the subject of Arcanum. Playing it makes me realized how ridiculous /pol/‘s view of society are, where sentient creatures still have their nature decided to be some arbitrary bullshit in the case of the orcs in the game and how even as much as they hate to admit it their views stemmed from religious creationism. But it’s still annoying to me how the only quest that deals with this is the quest about stopping the orc rebellion.

Delete
Report

no cookies?