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HOI4 general: "Who even plays unmoded?" edition Anonymous Gamer 04/02/2020 (Thu) 13:16:37 No. 258
Since /v/ is now open, I guess it is time to relocate here from /hobby/.
>>5090 >Nazi-Dengism I disagree. Speer in essence is still a straight up Nazi that endorses slavery and the system of racial exploitation and genocide. While Deng on the other hand is a social democrat pretending to be a communist. Even the gang of 4 in TNO are authoritarian liberals who build their “charade democracy” from a foundation of human corpses. Liberals and fascists are the same people, the only differences is the liberals still try to have a pretense to suck up to capitalism.
>>5110 Wait, I thought that Speer gets rid of slavery, at least officially?
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>>5112 Yes he does. >>5110 And look, I can understand why you would feel morally conflicted about Speer's route since it's basically rehabilitation of Nazi Germany (basically; reform rather than revolution), but out of the available options it's clearly the best one. Also, if you get the 'gang of four prevails' ending by not totally abolishing slavery until the slave revolt happens you get a truly blessed ending where you basically compromise with the slave revolters to go full socdem while killing the hyper-fascists It's definitely liberal porn but fuck it, I liked it.
>>5110 Based
>>5115 >It's definitely liberal porn but fuck it, I liked it. I hate it exactly because of this. Liberal porn in real life all turned out to be fascists with “election” in countries where the proles is forever cucked under the boot heels of porkies while thinking they’re free as they die and starve. Look at what happened to Thailand, Singapore, or any country that “democratized” after US backed dictatorships. It’s still the same party, putting the same corrupt people but now with backstage dealings and fraudulent elections where communists are banned and “suicided” because reasons while neofascists get to roam free.
>>5119 True, but is it really supposed to be realistic? 3/4 paths in Germany lead to continued Nazism afterall, and Speer will basically never win as an AI, so it's implicitly wish fulfillment.
Anyone here played Okinori Kaya? From the teasers he seemed like a pseudo-communist in his policies, if also a Japanese imperialist at the same time. So, is he any good, or just a 1984 totalitarian despot or some shit?
>>5120 Speer AI is bugged. When controlled by AI he never takes action against the megacorporations and always allows Schorner to crush the slaves.
>>5125 He’s a corporatist. His entire goal in breaking up the zaibatsus is not to make the economy fully planned, but to destroy their independence in ease of incorporating them into the state itself. The porkies behind the zaibatsus will just be controlling the government as well rather than wasting their their time in competitions, forming an iron heel of monopoly. It’s the central tenet of corporatism. Unless you’re an American or a Dengoid, this is not socialism, it’s more akin the Belgium Congo than anything else. Socialism is not when the state does stuff, especially when it’s still for profit in the case of corporatism.
>>5129 I thought he was able to go hardball and create a fully planned economy that would be in the hands of the Japanese bureaucracy, no?
>>5128 You could argue that was the AI working as intended, lol. But what I meant was that AI Speer will almost never win the civil war.
>>5131 Is it still based upon the profit motive, extreme level of commodity production in the arms industry, facilitating even more imperialist exploitation of the Co-Prosperity sphere? If the answer is yes then Japan under him just a nationalist version of walmart or amazon. Sad to see people here still compare technology-based plutocratic corporatism with cybernetic socialism. Even sadder to see idiots saying mega corporation planning is a good thing with calling out the pitfalls of the bourgeois ownership of the MoP and how it affects planning overall.
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What do we think of Yagoda? Would you choose his faction over Sablin's?
>>5169 Only if Bessonov came to power afterwards
>>5169 Yagoda is basically retarded in trying to be a continuation of the government that provably collapsed and failed rather than adapting to the situation somehow. His use of fear on other comrades as well prevents any kind of ideological flexibility, so if he did ever run into a situation a la the late USSR where the stagflation hit, the inflexible bureaucracy would fail to ever meaningfully address it, so any number of charlatans would try to seize on the government's ineptitude to be revisionist. At the end of the day his USSR would be the irl USSR but worse and would probably collapse faster. >Would you choose his faction over Sablin's? lmao no
>>4686 >>4687 Alexander Solynetzin definitely isn't portrayed positively in TNO if that's what your concern is. I don't recall if his real-life anti-semitism comes up during his path but he's shown to be the most evil, reactionary, and repressive of Vyatka's three potential chancellors. Plus there's the revelation later on that he's (unwittingly) being used as a pawn by Himmler to further his schemes, which is a bit of a bruh moment on Sol's part. I never got the sense that the devs have any fondness for Solynetzin given that he's generally written to be an asshole.
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>>4678 It's mentioned in some of the flavor text concerning Manchukuo that Kim Il Sung and his partisans are still active in the 1960's, so it feels like some kind of Korean communist uprising is planned for a future update. Ho Chi Minh is already featured as one potential communist rebel that can successfully BTFO the Japanese empire, so it stands to reason that other paths will follow. I would also love to see what the TNO equivalent of the Japanese "New Left" looks like. Assuming he hasn't been Order 44'd by the Kenpeitai, what is Inejirō Asanuma up to in the TNO world? Is he a popular dissident leader of some kind who's coordinating an empire-spanning, pan-Asianist socialist uprising with comrades in China and elsewhere?
>>5200 >what is Inejirō Asanuma up to in the TNO world? Wasn't he part of Tojo's cabinet OTL?
>>5201 Was he? His Wikipedia page doesn't mention that if that was the case. Apparently he was elected to the Diet in 1936 but he retired from politics until the end of WW2 because he disagreed with the empire's foreign policy decisions.
>>5205 Huh, could've sworn he was
>>5165 >Even sadder to see idiots saying mega corporation planning is a good thing with calling out the pitfalls of the bourgeois ownership of the MoP and how it affects planning overall. this probably comes from a misreading of people's republic of walmart
so i just downloaded tno which russian nation is best suited for reunifying soviet union and pushing back the nazis?
>>5249 WRRF either under Zhukov or Tukhachevsky. If you want good feelings the (Libsoc Sablin mixed with some Authsoc stuff)
>>5249 Just so you're not disappointed, you can't actually push the German puppets out of Moscow or beat the Nazis in the TNO version that's out now (the first ten years only).
>>5188 What I find most interesting about Yagoda is that the reforms that happen in Irkutsk occur regardless of Yagoda. Despite it being possible under his domain, the changes happen in spite of his repressive nature, even after he consolidates control. Also, if you spare him as Sablin, he ends up admiring to himself that his efforts were meaningless. This is what I love about TNO, it is easy to condemn Yagoda as a psycopathic dictator or a mistaken yet well-meaning Soviet politician but the point of Yagoda is to tell a story of what it is like to survive in TNO's Russia. I much as I personally prefer Sablin over him, I honestly think that the narrative of Yagoda is second best stories in TNO other than Speer continuing the status quo.
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Hmm yes, an error has occured (Seriously, it's been like this for nearly a fucking week now and it's a fucking pisstake)
>>5326 They broke the game anyway with the Bosphorous update, if you capture an airbase (or one of yours gets captured) all the planes in it get deleted now instead of moving elsewhere.
>>5335 Bruh
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>>5336 inorite I have no idea how they did that when the DLC doesn't even add any new mechanics
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playing radsocs in HOI4 basically made me an anarchist since they were the most fun syndie path is that bad?
>>5338 >is that bad? Nah, I personally prefer to go down Totalist paths myself
The problem I really have with the new order is despite the mod developers claims of being “Impartial to everyone but the Nazi’s” in regards to ideology it’s very easy to see their liberalism and actual Idealism showing When we get to things like The “HECKIN wholesome Sablin v Yagoda” or the entire subplot of the SocDem-Populist party in the US being “German agents” Like Sablin is portrayed as the “New Lenin” when in fact he does shit that Lenin...Just didn’t fucking do...Because in their attempt to make Sablin And with him the ideology of Libertarian socialism as wholesome as possible They whitewash Lenins actions as well
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Thoughts on Kaiserredux? I love it like Red Flood just for the memes and cool flags alone. >>5362 Anything aproaching communism is bad for them. Even when their liberalism made their minds into a bunch of self-contradictory garbage of mental gymnastics. Take the whole Hall presidency for example: >Hall demolishes the FBI and CIA. <No not the hecking FBI and CIAorinos!!! How would our "bastion of democracy" protect ourselves from other differing ideologies!?!? >No worries. He'll replace them with the NKVD with American characteristics. America is safe. <No you aren't supposed to do that because Soviets=BAD => NKVD=BAD!!!
>>5362 >SocDem-Populist party in the US being “German agents” Nigga, what?
>>5371 He's talking about NPP (which are in part supported by Germany, at least the Yockeys)
>>5369 Another funny depiction of the gommies asides from Hall and all the "EBIL HECKIN UNWHOLESOME NOT REAL SOCIALISM TANKIES" in Russia is the (Planned) content for the potential communist uprising in Germany which can form the "DSR" (Which is basically the DDR but led by the members of the R.A.F) Which literally seems to boil down to "The T A N K I E S are just as bad as the nazis because they have 're-education camps' where ANYONE they suspect of being a Nazi sympathiser is worked to death" Which is fucking stupid considering the DDR never fucking did that and went as far as to allow the actual returning veterans league of Wehrmacht soldiers to form their own political party and hold seats in parliament Also since making this post i've played Tyumen since the idea of Cornman being a Stalin loyalist instead of a critic sounded funny and yeah just as i expected >State is so cartonnishly and totalitarian everyone is made to have state forced marriages and eat nothing but stale loaves of bread. Like wow real true and groundbreaking critique of Marxism-Leninism.
>>5375 >>State is so cartonnishly and totalitarian everyone is made to have state forced marriages and eat nothing but stale loaves of bread. The fuck?
>>5377 Yeah as part of Tyumen's repopulation campaign the EBIL AUTHSOC TANKIES decide to enforce state mandated relationships. TNO is a lib mod so does anyone here really expect a unbiased Authsoc path that isn't just liberal dribbel.
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did somebody order world communism? also the new dlc is just focus trees lmao
2 things: 1) Is there any place where i can find HOI4 with the new dlc inside? 2) Seeing socialist electoral victory in Bolivia if some anon is capable why don't we design a focus tree for them lol?
>>5403 >1) Is there any place where i can find HOI4 with the new dlc inside? Legally is your best option, so steam or directly from paradox, but I'm pretty sure there's a cracked version of it somewhere >2) Seeing socialist electoral victory in Bolivia if some anon is capable why don't we design a focus tree for them lol? Would be based if someone did lmao
>>5385 To be fair they where really good focus trees.
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>>5362 >like The “HECKIN wholesome Sablin v Yagoda” Actually the devs have specifically designed the Sablin-Yagoda story to show how Sablin is both undermining Yagoda's efforts of stability in the Far East and also that Irkutsk can reform even if they defeat Sablin. The whole Sablin v Yagoda thing is not a black-and-white as you make it out to be, that's why Sablin-simps are often mocked (at least on the sub plebbit anyway) for being an idealistic wrecker. > he does shit that Lenin...Just didn’t fucking do For one, Sablin can be a lot more authoritarian if you go down the bukharinist path, or an idealistic libsoc puppy who wouldn't harm a fly. How Sablin is represented is down to the player to decide, not only the devs. It's called 'good storytelling'. >SocDem-Populist party in the US being “German agents” I may be wrong, but I believe this is a reference to the American anti-war movement which was full of both far-leftists and, obviously, nazi-lovers that ended up being infiltrated. I have not played the US yet so I dunno.
Sablintards: >Muh perfect no purgerino Yagodatards: >Well, akshullly if you follow specific Yagoda path then it will have very little state terror I love how its the purges and the "mean cursed" stuff that is a measure for success in the eyes of basically the entire HOI4 mod community. How about a better question, which one, if any of them, has an actually socialist economic program?
>>5419 >I love how its the purges and the "mean cursed" stuff that is a measure for success in the eyes of basically the entire HOI4 mod community Yeah imagine that, it's like they haven't brainwashed themselves with enough esoteric psued apologism to believe 'uhm actshually when a state with a red flag does massive state terror it's progressive and good'
>>5420 Based and can contain every example of existing within 1% of the USSR's lifespanpilled
>>5423 You do one purge and they never let you live it down!...
>>5419 Most of them are Bukharinists. Only a few of them like Kaganovich, Zhdanov and Tukhachevsky gave even a crap about planned economy.
>>5420 Let's turn this on its head, shall we? >Alternate reality >Panzer makes TNO, but libsocs and authsocs are switched as to which is idealized and which is demonized by exagerating history. >Be every libsoc country: <Anarchovich, my son, you are now choosing a country path. Will you: >Pick the blessed idealized authsoc version and become a "Stalin did not a single thing wrong" type tankies utopia with no oppression and a perfect planned economy (the correct choice you idiot, don't you know in whose favour the mod is biased?!?!?) >Compromise on libsoc even more and become socdem, the ultimate blesserino goodboyorino >Or pick [physically wretches] the libsoc path and murder every single nun, burn every ciltural monument that you perceive as reactionary and buldoze every church while working to death any captured opponent to your ideology. Oh and also your leader imports Burmese child sex slaves. <So, anarchovich, I think the correct path is obvious. Also do bear in mind that we will ban you from our subreddit if you deffend the libsoc path or try to disrespect our vision for the mod.
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>>5428 But that's not what 'libertarian socialist' represents. Number one, you are conflating it with anarchism which it isn't, it's orthodox Marxism but libertine. So while yes you could present them as having 'excesses' like the people going out and murdering nuns because the state doesn't have enough control, them having an organised campaign of political slavery wouldn't be 'libertarian'. Now look, I think TNO goes a bit overboard on the anti-tankieism, but ultimately, libertarian socialist paths are presented as better and more 'blessed' because they are. I mean are you really that surprised that people find doing political repression and murder to be a bummer? Authoritarian leftism has been a failure in historical terms. Now of course you can say that libertarian leftism hasn't succeeded either, but at the very least it fits modern 'sensibilities' better.


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